MARCH 21 :: NEW ZERO-TOLERANCE RELATED INCIDENT: Middle School in Amherst, Massachusetts censors school newspaper because of student poll results. Poll stemmed from discussion with principal about Zero Tolerance policies on discipline. Read more…
The Monterey Peninsula Unified School District in Seaside, California has just proven the age-old saying, ‘no good deed goes unpunished.’
15-year-old Marina High School student, Amanda Rouse, felt ill on her way to school last Wednesday morning, and decided to stay on her bus as it picked up elementary school students. The driver would take her home after the elementary route was finished.
However, by doing this, she didn’t follow proper procedure for leaving school grounds with her illness (checking out at the office, getting parent approval, etc.).
While the bus was driving the elementary route, the driver fell out of her seat at a sharp turn, and struck her head. The bus veered to the side and began hitting parked cars.
Rouse immediately jumped into action, hopped in the driver’s seat, applied the brakes and brought the bus to a safe stop.
So what does the school district do in response to this heroic act? Rouse was slapped with a weekend detention for ‘cutting class.’
The problem here is that years of absolute zero-tolerance thinking have left public school administrators with a very black and white attitude - no room for grey areas, no room for judging each infraction on its own merits.
Rouse should not be punished, she should be praised. School administration should waive the detention and instead thank this girl for her quick-thinking act of bravery.
132 comments ↓
Truly a disgrace - what kind of example does this give to other students: Don’t do the right thing, you might get punished.
Ridiculous. There is probably no stupider person on the planet than a high school administrator. Power-hungry morons. I think I will call the school on Monday morning and complain…
Too true that schools no longer see gray areas when it comes to discipline. They can’t judge for themselves any longer - I’m glad my kids are out of the public school system. If they were still of school age, I’d have to have a lawyer programmed into my speed dial.
As a middle-school administrator, I can’t agree that we’re all morons, as one of the comments above suggests - but I will say that a large percentage of my coworkers fit that bill. However in this day and age it is very difficult to handle any discipline matters - you’re dammed if you do and dammed if you don’t, in most cases. I do think the administration at Marina High made the wrong decision here - Amanda should have received no formal punishment. Perhaps just a meeting with her and her parents to remind her of the procedures for signing out of school sick.
And who cares about school policies and “punishments” (not most kids anyway :P)? Apart from lesson-education, school today has absolutely no effect to the development of personality and character. Kids just know it’s a nonsense blackbox and go along -laughing their ass off about how irrelevant it is to the real world.
The whole concept that you can “punish” a 15-year old teenager -or force him/her to “behave” with rules that he considers (and, quite frankly, are) unimportant, is wrong. At that age the teenager can judge for himself most common situations and should be treated more like an adult.
If school wants to be respected by students, it should first learn to not underestimate them -not only in total-nonsense cases like this, but in every-school-day little things as well. If not, well, no big deal, it just stays irrelevant
This is one of the web’s most interesting stories on Sun 16th Mar 2008…
These are the web’s most talked about URLs on Sun 16th Mar 2008. The current winner is …..
DR Milbank on 03.16.08 at 1:04 pm said:
” Ridiculous. There is probably no stupider person on the planet than a high school administrator. Power-hungry morons. I think I will call the school on Monday morning and complain…”
Actually, there is a more stupid person and that is someone who actually thinks ” stupider ” is a word.
public school graduate I presume?
Gosh please don’t tell me you went to college.
Why would you punish someone, for saving peoples’ lives? It’s completely idiotic! This school system is a disgrace for doing such a thing as punishing someone who saved lots of lives!
I can guarantee that Livermore will be getting more phone calls about the student that saved their childs’ lives getting punished, rather than their child who is now dead!
For the love of Odin, please read John Taylor Gatto’s book on the American Education System he spent 9 years researching. Thank you.
http://www.johntaylorgatto.com/
“Perhaps just a meeting with her and her parents to remind her of the procedures for signing out of school sick.”
This from a middle school administrator. Rather petty, don’t you think, Mr Administrator?
David Arnold on 03.16.08 at 7:26 pm said:
Actually, there is a more stupid person and that is someone who actually thinks ” stupider ” is a word.
It’s in the Oxford American Dictionary, the American Heritage Dictionary, and the Random House Unabridged Dictionary. Who’s the stupid one?
Here’s my letter to the principal:
Subj: Drug policy at your school?
I’d like to know what drugs the administrators at your school are on, and if I may buy some. It must be pretty good stuff, and given your policy on obeying the letter of the law, they won’t even get me in any trouble!
Perhaps the police should arrest her for operating a vehicle without a license… and I’m sure a school bus requires a special license as well… make sure to account for that.
The people that run publics schools will run public healthcare if/when it is applied. these same “people” fix our roads, run the DMV, etc. Exacty what I want to do - give idiots more money and control over our lives……
Moral of the story: People in authority are a-holes. Resist and oppose them every chance you can. They are the Enemy.
public*
I disagree - she knew the rules, she failed to follow the rules. This is just what the terrorist want! Do you people want Sadam Hussein to attach us again?
Absolute idiocy.
“Zero-tolerance” always has meant zero common sense.
wow…
i graduated high school a year and a half ago. if this would have happened at my school, the girl would have been given some sort of award of merit and probably would have been recognized at her graduation ceremony. at least! i truly dislike high school administrators on the whole, though i met two who were truly decent people.
i can’t wait to call the school tomorrow :-).
I 100% recommend every one sending this douche and e-mail and/or a phone call telling him what a douche he is.
#17, wow.
Zero tolerance need not imply “zero thought.” In a day and age where educators are trying to make school more relevant, risk-averse administrators (and school boards) send a message to kids that the ability to evaluate information and make an intelligent decision is overrated. I am sure the policy was put into place to protect the students’ safety and well-being, and ironically, her presence on the bus did just that.
If anything, the administration should apologize to the girl and the district should be thanking her…and then begin finding leaders who are not afraid to think.
How come no one has noticed the bus driver in all of this? Sure, it was darn lucky the girl was on the bus, but how on earth did the bus driver “fall out of her seat at a sharp turn”? On my school buses, the driver always had a seat belt. And aside from that, how on Earth did she take a turn sharp enough to fall out of the seat?
Aside from that, the bus driver knew the girl was on the bus - she was going to take her home after the elementary school route. The driver should be punished for allowing her to stay, not the girl!!
Regardless, I understand why they had to punish the girl. She could not possibly have known that the driver was going to fall unconscious during the ride - it was by chance that she saved the kids. Were the school to forgo punishment, there’s no telling how many kids would skip, and later on say “But I was afraid the driver would hit her head! I could have saved lives! You can’t punish me for trying to save lives!”
Yeah… I already emailed Don Livermore directly. Hes more concerned with policy then the fact that the young woman saved quite a few kids from getting hurt, or hurt worse.
This principal has suffered from epic failure.
Let me try and put this in a way that might find purchase with those who would hold reign in the bastions of academia.
You’re a clown show and you suck and you should be running a dry cleaners.
First off, to Steve Dean: I don’t know if you’ve been hiding in a cave for the past year or not, but Hussein is DEAD! We kinda killed him in December. Unless Sadam has figured out a way to come back from the dead, I think the only threat we face is intolerant bastards like you.
Second, I have to say that I don’t agree with either side. Yes, she should have gone into the school office and gone through proper procedures, but most kids today don’t even know what the school procedures are. The school shouldn’t punish her just because she forgot to tell the officials, and the girl should remember to have someone call her in sick.
As for zero-tolerance, destroy it. I remember a time when two people could hate each other, go behind the sport shed after school and beat each other into a bloody pulp, and then laugh about it afterwards. Todays children allow themselves to be treated poorly because of the school’s “anti-bully” teachings. They are forced to believe that fighting will not solve their problems, because if they fight back they will get punished. If they try to let someone in authority know what’s going on, the authority doesn’t do anything! Or, if they DO do something, they’ll send the kid to a psychiatrist to receive “special help”. and then it all builds up inside the child, and you get another Columbine; which, in turn creates more scenarios like this.
And people wonder why this world’s going crazy.
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/stupider
to david arnold, how stupider are you know lmao, did you go to college?
what is even stupider is someone who denegrates (look it up) anothers arguments over semantics and diction when everyone gets the point (the real point of communication). a typical strategy of an arrogant, egotistical flametard.
To somebody in that town: how about a gift certificate or a scholarship to Amanda or…… give a kick in the butt to the school administrators.
Well, maybe she just just sue the hell out of the school for emotional damages, not to mention that whiplash that just started to hurt… Idiots in charge, plain and simple.
Whatever they did to her…it’s not worse than this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eBGIQ7ZuuiU
Sadaam Hussein changed his oil from dollars to euros. he did not attack the usa. the dollar is crashing and the oil countries are moving off of the mushy dollar as their trade currency. usa #1 is gone now. you Americans should really figure out who did your 9/11. The rest of the world knows. Your media continues to perpetuate Big Lie. You continue to believe a little story told to you to get you excited. you certainly did get excited. USA is extremely naive country. Now you pay as your economy goes just as null as your lack of good judgment.
The school system should hold a conference in the girl’s honor!!!
I think that everything happens for a reason. If she had followed proper proceedure those children and the bus driver could have suffered far worse injuries.
@ David Arnold
holy cow you went to college!!????
you must be a GENIUS (genius: IQ = 1000)!!!!! I hope you didn’t go to a *PUBLIC* college, though… that would have been horrible!!!
I am an seventeen year old familiar with this sort of nonesense. I was terrorized by my high school administrators for having mono and being held in the hospital. I missed a month of school and they tried to tell me I would not get any credits for the year. Needless to say, my father had our lawyer on speed dial. I left the school and home schooled myself, and what do you know, I graduated a full year early.
I’ll be calling them tomorrow.
My question is “why did the silly female driver fall out of her seat?” She must take that route every day if it’s a school run, she must have known how sharp the turn was. Either she was drunk or speeding, possibly both. The point should be not the “heroic” girl, but the stupid driver!
The bus driver was not wearing her set belt and is under investigation for the loss of control.
http://origin.montereyherald.com/local/ci_8556799
As well, the family knew the student should have gone into the office or stayed home.
But none the less, what is going on here when administration staff can not think with common sense and see that while the student was in error, in this case it proved a good thing.
For the fear others kids will go home sick, I assume most schools are like my son’s school. A phone call to our home and an e-mail is sent when they are 1) tardy to class or 2) absent.
Just ill.
If anyone in the chain would have sense he’d kick the responsible person out of his job.
It’s nothing that can happen on mistake, it just shows that this person (Don Livermore according to the article) is definitly not fit for this job.
You need more than age to judge.
best regards from europe
By this “entering the school grounds” argument, if her mother had driven her, and her mother decided she was too sick to go to school as they pulled up to the door, Amanda would be subject to detention unless she first ran in and checked out at the school office. That strike anyone else as ridiculous?
Forget the heroism; her act of staying on the bus on its own merits didn’t deserve punishment. She was ill, under the watch of a presumably-responsible adult (the bus driver), and was headed home, having never entered the school building. That it didn’t fit a formal procedure should be irrelevant.
She is not facing discipline for saving the kids, she was skipping school. Just because someone does something good while doing something wrong, does not excuse the wrongdoing.
Example:
If it had not been Amanda, but instead been an adult on the bus molesting the children when the driver fell out of their seat and the molester jumped into action to save the day, would all of you people be crying that the molester should not face the penalty for his wrongdoing?
There’s a good reason why many parents can’t stand school teachers, administrators, librarians and the like…and that’s because they’re often more focused upon strictly interpreting and enforcing “rules” rather than applying common sense in addressing situations as they develop. Even judges use discretion in applying the law to a given situation. I guess this is what you get when you have a bunch of “booksmart” people who go on powertrips with children.
Even if the school admins wanted to prevent students from disobeying rules in the future, is it really worth all the negative PR?
Ok so lets also look at the fact that she wasn’t ditching school to go do drugs or anything. She didn’t get off the bus and walk to a friends house to smoke pot. She stayed on the bus to go home. She didn’t feel well. That school will definitely get a call from me!
#31 - I see what you did there… was *not* expecting a Rickroll, that’s for sure. FWIW, here’s a picture of the principal, Don Livermore. He’s the one standing with the yellow tie: http://www.marinachamber.com/uploads/media/Don%20Livermore%20speaking.jpg
Back in the day, she’d have been thanked and honored by the school and the community. We condemn people who stand and do nothing when tragedy happens, and when someone does do a selfless act for the common good, to protect those in harm’s way, she is punished. I guess I’d better not run in to Livermore’s office if it’s on fire, because I didn’t apply for a Visitor’s Pass at the front desk first.
Hmm - take a look at the school’s mission statement: Our mascot is the Mariner, the ancient astronaut of the past. The mariner was the risk taker; the bravest, boldest of their time navigating uncharted waters to seek knowledge of the unknown world as well as opportunities for new beginnings and a better life.
We see our students as similar to these early explorers, taking risks, meeting challenges, and succeeding in finding their direction for achieving success. These years are important in that they have great influence on future choices. We encourage our students to use these years to their advantage by being involved participants. The entire staff is here to support our students academically and in extra-curricular endeavors and ultimately help them to navigate toward their goals, their future.
Please tell me now, how does what the administration just did to this poor student encourage other students to take risks and be the “bravest, boldest of their time”???
I’m so glad I’m out of public school. But I worry what it will be like for my children in 8 or 10 years. I hope the community comes together and does something wonderful for this girl, after all the crap Marina High has put her through.
The reason schools are burdened with so many policies and rules is because many parents have given their children free rein over their lives, and little or no respect for authority. Has anybody given any thought that both the driver and the child broke the rules. Can some one be held accountable here?
I sent the following email to Mr. Livermore (address above):
Mr. Livermore-
Let me ask you this…How much time would be lost if, during a fire in your school building during school hours, you required every first responder to use only one entrance door and register for a visitor’s pass (in other words, follow the rules) before running down the hall to save lives? Sometimes, the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the principal. You and your administration should be down on your knees thanking God…oops, sorry. Rules again. You should be glad that Miss Rouse was on that bus and, even though ill, was able to bring that vehicle to a stop before anyone was seriously injured or worse. How can you face this girl? Or her parents? Or the parents of every child on that bus? If any common sense was available to anyone in the school administration, you’d be naming a classroom or a library or even the bus garage after her. And this in the state that wants to end home schooling? This is the kind of thinking that drives us to home schooling.
This is quite a controversial topic. I can’t take any side as nothing but the story is told. No back story, no what the girl did after, which in this case seems to be go to school. I don’t even know how they found out she was sick! The commenters, as well as yourself, are complaining about a story with no real How element to it. This is as far as I see it. Comments 24 and 40 push me to the side that she should be punished, however 45 makes me think the staff is retarded and should be complained to anyway. This is an obviously biased article (What isn’t?) and should be rewritten from BOTH points of view and in detail to let people think for themselves. I’m looking at you Del.
I agree with the school. If that girl had not followed proper procedure then she SHOULD be punished!
Who cares that she possibly saved lives? The fact is, she broke the rules. Deal with it you flunky!
Besides, she has now changed what was God’s plan for those children. To die a firey death on a school bus. So not only will she be punished by the school but now, she deserves to go to live with Satan.
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Be shoore to soupport yer publick skoolz.
MITIGATING circumstances - CRIMINALS can have their sentences reducted due to ‘mitigating circumstances’ like they had a difficult childhood. Wouldn’t the fact that this child was SICK and was only thinking about getting home as quickly as possible… be a ‘mitigating circumstance’? She’s a CHILD and a HERO and SICK — but she can’t be cut a break? but someone who murdered his family can be cut a break because his mommy didn’t love him enough can get a break on his sentence>? WTF??
From the above:
—–So what does the school district do in response to this heroic act? Rouse was slapped with a weekend detention for ‘cutting class.’—–
What exactly is a *weekend detention*?
Without knowing for sure, I would almost venture to say (note I said almost) that was an unofficial/official punishment.
Meaning quite simply that she was given a detention (thusly not being shown ‘favoritism’ for her infraction) in a tongue and cheek manner.
No school over the weekends, after all.
this is absolutely crazy. “oh you saved somebody’s life, but you should have done it in proper order, so now you have detention bitch…”
people is so crazy these days.. this is like my school. a student who is skipping class because she feels like it, will have the SAME punishment as a student who stays to FINISH a project and walked in the hall without a pass to their class.. that is so stupid. i don’t know who they’re trying to motivate with these rules.. this is why our public schools are failing.. they put rules on top of more rules on top of MORE rules.. the hell wrong with them.
and they LOVE to underestimate EVERY student possible.
Fire the idiot who made the decision, it is the only way this will stop. Time after time we hear another horror story of a kid suspended for a butterknife, a 5 year old suspended for sexual assault for kissing another, a child expelled for some minor idiot infraction. The only way to stop these ‘bad decisions’ from repeating is to start firing the decider’s.
So the prinicpal thinks that the girl should be suspended, well he or she obviously lacks the basic common sense a rock has. Therefore they are unsuited to further employment.
Once sackings start to happen for idiot decisions then idiot decisions will start to be rethought.
Zero tolerance is a nice way to say Zero Thought
I know I am in the minority here, but I think she should receive whatever is the “normal” punishment for not following the sickness procedure.
AND
I also think she should be treated as a HERO. Each issue is should stand on its own.
Imagine this…a man steals a car (a more extreme example) and then crashes that car by accident into a carload of terrorists on their way to blow something up (again, an example taken to the extreme). Is this man a HERO or did he commit a crime? Or both?
Yet another reason to homeschool…
This may help…contact info for the school
http://www.mpusd.k12.ca.us/contact.html#Administration
Mr. Livermore,
Are you out of your mind? You must be. As a school teacher in both Chicago and California, I have seen my fair share of incorrigible and habitually flagrant students. To chastise and punish this student for taking action into her hands and helping to bring the bus to a safe stop saving all of those children from serious injury or worse, because she did not follow procedure with regard to illness. Ach Tung mine commandant. You should get down and kiss her ass for being there. It is the driver whose fat ass fell out of her seat because I am sure she wasn’t wearing a seat belt. That’s who should be chastised.
Very disappointed educator in California
READ the article. Her quick action possibly saved the lives of the elementary age students and driver BUT, she was punished for DITCHING school. If she was so sick she should have gotten off and went to the nurses office. I don’t think california has cut that from their budget yet. If the driver was wearing her seatbelt this would have never happened.
Actually, I would disagree with those who disagree with the school here. (Not saying that I agree with the school, though.) Yes, she did something heroic, and should be rewarded. But that is unrelated to her breach of policy, and I don’t see why she should be forgiven on the grounds of tht.
Now, all she did wrong was fail to comply with a slight technicality. So I disagree with the weekend’s detention (see, I told you I didn’t agree with the school); all that would be needed would be to have a quiet word with her and/or her parents and explain what it is she ought to do when she’s feeling sick - who to notify, etc. But the fact that she did something unrelatedly good shouldn’t affect that.
If she’d seen some dangerous situation and skipped class specifically to go and assist, then yes, that would be a time when a heroic action should cause a punishment to be waived. If she’d skipped class on a pretense, and just gone off strolling through the town doing her own thing, and in the process managed to do some good deed, then the punishment should stand. You can’t justify wrongdoing by saying “Oh but I’ve done something good too” - you can’t atone for stealing a child by building an orphan asylum, nor can you rob a bank and be made innocent by endowing a bishopric.
You need to remember. Schools in Cal get paid by the state per student. if she would have gone to school, went to the office, went to the nurse and them call her parent to come and get her. They would have received money for her being there. By her just going home they dont get any money. Remember follow the money. Schools in Cal are crooked. Thats why classroom sizes are so high. They dont want to build new schools. Why should they they make more just over packing the schools they have. hopefully she will get an honer from the city or something or someone will give her money towards college. But the schools just want to make sure they get there cut.
#40, While it doesn’t excuse wrongdoing, we don’t know that she was doing anything wrong, merely against rules. But highschoolers generally know what you don’t, that rules don’t always make sense, and sometimes are worth being broken (and illness is certainly not her fault.)
And implying a rule-breaker is like a child molestor is despicable.
Livermore,
Have you been blinded to generous acts by absorbing too many rules and regulations or did you overdose on your stupid pills?
The idea that she should be punished for “skipping school” or “not signing in” is ridiculous. She wasn’t skipping school, she was sick. If she got sick while walking to school, would she have to go all the way to the school and sign in before going home, or could she just turn back? What if she felt too ill to leave the bus, go to the office, and the wait for someone to pick her up (if anyone was even available to pick her up)?
The only reason anyone found out that she was on the bus but did not make it inside the school was that accident.
Had the accident not happened, she would simply have been ABSENT, and would have brought in a note from her mom the next day saying she was sick, making it an excused absence.
I’m a senior in high school, and someone made the comment that school has no effect at all on how we behave and interact in our world. That, I feel, is totally untrue. I know first hand what not paying attention does to students who are in school, and I’ve seen the flip side of it too, in students who DO pay attention. Those kids are the ones who hardly ever get in trouble, get great grades, dress fairly decently, and usually have a good head on their shoulders. That comes from the discipline and structure we’re given at school. It makes all the difference in the world regarding how we turn out developmentally.
What this girl did was brave, very brave, and they shouldn’t have reprimanded her in anyway, even if she did “cut class”, which, technically, she didn’t. I don’t think she’s technically at school until she walks through those doors. Probably doesn’t make a difference till the bell rings either. The only reason she even got in trouble was because it was noticed that she was out of school when she got the attnetion for saving those kids, and of course, someone was going to get in trouble if they didn’t do something. If nothing had happened, she probably would have just gone home, had her mom or dad call her out, and no one would have cared, but she didn’t get that far. Personally, whoever gave her detention should sit in for her for her hour. She didn’t do anything wrong.
What exactly is a *weekend detention*?
Without knowing for sure, I would almost venture to say (note I said almost) that was an unofficial/official punishment.
Meaning quite simply that she was given a detention (thusly not being shown ‘favoritism’ for her infraction) in a tongue and cheek manner.
No school over the weekends, after all.
Nope, it’s kind of the opposite.
WEEKEND DETENTION is when a student has to come to school on a weekend in order to serve the detention.
There is an upside. Brainless government school administrators are teaching our children at an early age that they (basically government bureaucrats) are just plain dumb and lack any ability at rational thought or judgement. This lesson will stick with them until they reach maturity, when they start to realize that people just like this are also making political decisions regarding how they should also conduct their adult lives.
They are going to become Libertarians!
I don’t know the whole story, but it sounds as though this girl was on the bus for a reason. Perhaps she felt ill because her purpose was to save those children.
Personally, I think this was fate or divine intervention. It’s the little things like this that make me more and more convinced that there is someone up there watching over us.
Charles.
Actually David Arnold, “stupider” is a word.
“http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/stupider”
stu·pid /?stup?d, ?styu?/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[stoo-pid, styoo?] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation adjective, -er, -est, noun
–adjective 1. lacking ordinary quickness and keenness of mind; dull.
2. characterized by or proceeding from mental dullness; foolish; senseless: a stupid question.
3. tediously dull, esp. due to lack of meaning or sense; inane; pointless: a stupid party.
4. annoying or irritating; troublesome: Turn off that stupid radio.
5. in a state of stupor; stupefied: stupid from fatigue.
6. Slang. excellent; terrific.
–noun 7. Informal. a stupid person.
——————————————————————————–
[Origin: 1535–45; < L stupidus = stup(ére) to be numb or stunned + -idus -id4]
—Related forms
stu·pid·ly, adverb
stu·pid·ness, noun
KG, If she had not been on the bus, just think of how many kids could have been hurt, also think of how many adults could have been hurt if no one was in control of the vehicle. So be it, she is only a teenager, more than likely without a permit or license, but she was in the right place at the right time, and took care of the situation and prevented a future string of mishaps.
There’s an article in the Monterey County Herald on this, here’s the link:
http://www.montereyherald.com/local/ci_8556799
There’s also a forum over there where you can share your opinions on this. It might help to post there at the local paper where it will attract more attention from those who live in Amanda’s community. Here’s the link for the forum:
http://www.topix.net/forum/source/monterey-county-herald/TB0432NKICO6GDJGI
I believe we have found the problem …
Whoops, doesn’t allow images. Just have to do it the other way:
http://www.gooutcheap.com/images/Blog/livermore.jpg
It’s a shame the scool thinks Otherwise !
But if there were death, there would be pardon, spit for me to tel you this your feelings are ZerO towerdrs a child .And what did the Other Children had to tel you for how did it acure ?and ho is the falt or not.
No feelings towerds a Chils ? thats Bad….
from Bart from the Netherlands,Holland
I guess the school principal is mad because he couldn’t make a funeral speech.
Kudos to this brave girl for her actions. She should be praised and not punished.
Let’s assume she didn’t end up saving a bus load of tots from harm, but had simply gone home on the bus as planned. Typical government school reaction. Maybe they should have taken into account her record - does she skip class a lot, etc? Maybe both of her parents work, and had she gone to school and gone to the office, her mom or dad would have had to leave work or arrive late to work to pick her up from school. Seems to me its a whole lot easier to just go home and get in touch with a parent to have them call her in as sick for the day.
That’s called “making sense”, a concept school administrators don’t often understand. Then again, these are government employees who practically have guaranteed jobs and don’t have to answer to anybody for their mistakes or inefficiencies. If I was in that position I’d probably turn my brain off and go through my day like a robot, too.
The stupidity of school administration certainly doesn’t come cheap! I did a search on the district superintendent’s name, and found that she recently purchased a home for over $1 million. Sheesh. How do I get in on this racket?
http://www.montereyherald.com/propertytransactions/ci_6063863
“I’m glad my kids are out of the public school system. If they were still of school age, I’d have to have a lawyer programmed into my speed dial.”
Not to defend public schools, because they pretty much are defenseless, but it is because people have attitudes like yours (ready to call a lawyer at every second for every perceived misdeed) that the public schools have such a black and white system as discussed.
Ban school buses for the children!
I think that we all need to email the school as I have to make your thoughts heard! It is sad that they aren’t giving this girl a break!
Shows that Calif Sucks.
This is why “zero-tolerance” is so incredibly stupid. It cuts out common sense altogether. God forbid anyone in administration have to THINK for a change.
Another reason to NOT live in California.
I knew it. They’ve all traded their brains for their Masters Degrees. The child has more sense than any of them. I teach my kids that thinking for themselves is never a bed thing. Too bad these administrators’ parents weren’t successful in teaching their children that lesson.
That just goes to show you how much importance is placed on the “following the rules” in our public schools. First and foremost its the loss of common sense in the admistration. This is a public school, not a prison system, its only function should be to educate the child, not micromanage every minute of their lives from birth to twelth grade. Its all about control and indoctrination, not the good of the child.
Being a teacher I have to put my two cents worth in. I disagree with the administration she should not have been punished. However schools in this country a lot of the time are not allowed to use discretion when handing out punishments because of law suits. What if she had been hurt on the bus? She was supposed to have been at school. The district would have been liable. Did anyone besides the bus driver know she was on the bus? What if the accident had happened after the elementary students had been dropped off and both her and the bus driver had been injured or killed. She would have just been missing because she did not follow procedrues.
Maybe God had a hand in this…. Just maybe she was meant to be there on that school bus.
To bad not very many people look for the miracle in this. Has anyone thought what could of happened if she wasn’t there?
Very well said #27!!!!!
jfred @ #88, You’re mistaken about how public school is “not a prison system”. The children are given no choice, therefore they are imprisoned. Shame on the parents for putting their children through the same abuse that they were forced to endure.
What do you want to bet that the school administrator in question has a Hillary! or Obama! bumper sticker on his car?
California! The land of fruits,nuts, and flakes!
Stupider is as stupider does. Rulers were made to be broken. Never trust anyone older than 30 seconds. The only thing common about common sense is its lack of commonality.
And I’m all out of bastardized cliches, folks. But hey, what I wouldn’t give for a good ol’ Solomon leading this country right about now.
I agree with 87. The school does have lawsuit to consider. I think that the girl should get detention AND should be publicly praised for her quick actions. The school can have, after all, more than one reaction to an incident.
this reminds me of the time i saved a bunch of babies from a burning building, but still got arrested just because i happened to be creeping around the orphanage in the nude.
go to my website for amazing off-beat news.
She was not being punished for the act of saving lives. She was punished for not properly signing out of school.
We are living in stange times. We extect so much from teens but give nothing when a teen shows fast smart thinking. #27 is on the mark.
#40, I really hope you’re not a teacher. If that is how you teach your students, then the parents of your students should have their children taken away for letting them be subjected to child abuse. And to the rest of you who say the heroic girl should be punished, observe what she did and what she should be punished for. She is going to be punished for not following a school policy. She didn’t break a law nor did she put anyone’s life in danger. She simply was feeling too ill to go to class and wanted to return home. The real world actually operates in shades of gray. If I didn’t show up to work one day and was sick, my boss most probably wouldn’t fire me over it. And if he did, I’d go get a new job. Unfortunately, this girl doesn’t have such a luxury. She’s going to have to stay subjected to this awful government school. I hope someone with the resources available gives her a private school scholarship so she can get the hell out of there.
More than likely this girl is able to apply herself. She should tell the school to F@#$ Off, drop out get her GED go to a community college get an AA or AS then head to a four year university. In the technology age one doesn’t need to go to high school.
Pay peanuts get monkeys. If we paid better we’d get better people. Right now you get people who don’t have the ambition to enter private enterprise. Doesn’t mean they are *bad* people, just not motivated.
#50 Doug - You creep me out. Are you some psycho super Religon freak or something?
Origional post is:
I agree with the school. If that girl had not followed proper procedure then she SHOULD be punished!
Who cares that she possibly saved lives? The fact is, she broke the rules. Deal with it you flunky!
Besides, she has now changed what was God’s plan for those children. To die a firey death on a school bus. So not only will she be punished by the school but now, she deserves to go to live with Satan.
Wow. I’m scared of you now.
Without her, some of those kids might be dead. If it was god’s plan, It would of happened anyway, and the girl would of gone to school despite being sick. That’s like saying “A 15 year old girl can overpower GOD by getting this bus under control. She should go to hell because she saved people.”
I mean, that’s horrible! Come on!
[…] ← No Good Deed Goes Unpunished: Girl Who Saves Busload of Elementary Students Given Detention […]
Believe me, if the school does not follow the rules and punish her for not following procedure, some other kid will say, “Well, you didn’t punish Amanda…yada, yada, yada…” However, I think Amanda should be commended for her quick thinking during an emergency.
Let me get this straight, she wasn’t even *at* school yet, but she had to go tell the office she was going home sick? That makes absolutely no sense. Sounds like the school thinks they own the students from the second they leave their homes. As someone else pointed out, if she started walking to school and felt too ill to go, would she still have had to go to the office to tell them she was sick? I think a brain transplant is required for the administrators, they seem to be missing theirs.
okay lisa so let me get you straight…the bus had finished the marina high school route and went onto another route in seaside 5 miles away. in otherwords she could have gotten off at school. and actually the school is responsible for them the second they get on that bus. if she was walking to school(marina is not that big) her parents would be responsible. if she was to sick to walk grandma should have called the school. hmmm yeah..think about it.
Saying what she did was wrong because she didn’t follow a policy is illogical; not all laws, policies or rules are good, just or infallible. The school is covering its ass. And stop the conjecture about how she could have been hurt — she wasn’t. This evidence is enough proof of her abilities. I think she knew she had to get on the bus in her subconsious and precognitively and that’s what made her sick. The right and moral decision is not always a lawful one. Civil disobedience and righteous rebelling for the betterment of others and ourselves is part of our heritage as Americans. I am a teacher, a mother and a businesswoman. What happened with this girl is a symbol of how many Americans feel about the pernicious bureacracy of corporations and government and the people who run them mistaking rules for morals. Kudos to 60 and 23.
This is a sad world that we live in today. Our schools are failing our children. This no tolerance policy is ridiculous. Our children didn’t enlist in the military. We need to take back our schools from these tyrants. Would put up with this in your workplace? Why would anyone allow your children to be subject to these policies? Speak out and take action. I am happy to read that most of you who have responded to this article have common sense. This girl does not need to be punished. If she were really skipping school, why would she stay on the bus, with the bus driver as a witness? She could have left and no one would have even known she was at school to begin with. I hope anyone who lives in this district rallies to get the administrator/principal removed!
Do ya think maybe watching the driver fall out of her seatr and the bus on it’s “own” may have been tragic for this kid? Yes indeed she did the right thing. There is a reason she did not get off the bus don’t ya think?
Seems to me this school is on a power trip and they need to get over it. I would fight them tooth and nail if it were my daughter.
To “Someone” she felt sick while on the bus and made a decision to continue on the bus because it would eventually return back to her home, or she could have got off the bus and went into the school and have to go through the hassle of the administrative policies, which you know is government and who knows how long it would take before she could leave, also a parent would have to travel, possibility away from work, to get her. So she had two choices, 1. Stay on the bus and return home in a timely manner, or 2. Go to school and go through the hassle of a government administration and red tape… go figure. I think I get it, once children are under the responsibility of the government (public school), they are not educated enough to make decisions on their own, they must have government approval. Typical liberal thought process. Zero tolerance equals zero intelligence, every situation must be handled under a case by case basis, but liberals don’t like making decisions because it makes them think.
Had she followed procedure, she would have been held in the office until her parents were able to pick her up. Depending on their jobs, this could have taken a very long time to arrange, and would likely have been incredibly inconvenient. Meanwhile, the girl may not have even had a cot to lie down on because many schools (my alma mater included) eliminated them when they got rid of the school nurse.
If there was a cell phone available, she should have called her parents and advised them of the situation…Of course, she may have actually done this and we wouldn’t know, because it wasn’t mentioned in the article. This allows her parents to know where she is and properly contact the school regarding her absence.
In my opinion, if she did not have a record of ‘ditching’ school and being irresponsible, she should not have been punished. The driver, on the other hand….
No, the student should not be punished!!! But what’s up with the bus driver? I can’t imagine that she’s allowed to make the decision to bring the child back home without a parent’s consent or the schools. She should be in detention not the student!
this reminds me of when I had my hand in a car door, and it hurt, so I screamed. “” How many times were you told Paula, not to scream, now stop that, you aren’t behaving correctly. You ! WILL GO TO YOUR ROOM and you will learn not to scream next time, that your hand gets smashed in the car door, UNDERSTAND??! ! !!!”"
In most districts, kids waiting at a bus stop and on a bus are said to be on school property. Mostly for discipline purposes - if a fight (or other ‘bad behavior’) occurs a bus stop, should those kids not be punished? It can’t work both ways - they cannot rightly pick and choose which infractions should be enforced where.
Its a technicality, but to be honest about it, she happened to save those children because she had broken a rule. I think weekend detention is a bit severe for that considering she *was* sick, but its also a bit silly to say someone shouldn’t be punished at all for breaking the rules because she was lucky enough to be on a bus driven by an incompetent driver. (And, for the record, just because someone in authority lets you get away with something you shouldn’t, doesn’t make it okay.)
Her parents should have been contacted by the admin and that’s it. Its not like she had time to get back home and call in sick.
America’s public schools at their best. I can’t believe that they had the nerve to punish this girl. What was she supposed to do, let the bus veer into oncoming traffic and kill someone? I think she should be praised for being such a heroine.
Seeing how as I can’t truely tell you haow I feel on this matter, because my words would not be suitable for the younger people on here.
This young girl, did the right thing.
She felt ill, and rather than staying at school and risk the other students getting sick, she decided that she would return home.
Put yourself in the shoes of those elmemtary school childerns parents.
The driver becomes incompasitated, and there isn’t anyone else on board the bus, except the young girl.
Imagine how much worse it could have been if she wasn’t there.
Hi all I am a Marina High Student and I can’t beleive what you morons are saying about my principal Mr. Livermore. You stupid people need to get your facts straight. First off the bus was not going very fast and the bus hit only two cars that were parked and very minor damage was done to them. Amanda was not where she was suppose to be and if she felt sick all she needed to do was go to the office and ask to call home. She didn’t follow procedure and that is why she is being punnished.
I am Amanda’s grandmother. We are all very proud of her. I have to agree with Bob though. Amanda did break the rules and she is taking responsibility for it and wants to serve Saturday school. Amanda feels it wouldn’t be fair to the other students that get Saturday school for the same reason. Mr. Livermore is an awesome principle!!! He didn’t give her Saturday school. That was the assistant principle. She will also be getting recognition from the district. Thanks to all of you for caring!
Ms. Correll, I can only imagine how proud you are of Amanda, both for stopping the bus and for accepting responsibility for breaking the school rules.
I work for a small private college in Western New York. I was talking to our Director of Academic Support Services and another faculty member recently, and they were lamenting on the inability of our freshmen to research their problems, consider the consequences and make informed decisions to find a solution.
It seems to me Amanda did just that, but was given less time to find a solution than our students get. Even if she didn’t know about the rules, she was on a bus already, and the driver said she would take her home after her route. That’s a solution, and it was passed through an authority figure.
Any sensible school administrator would hold Amanda innocent of any wrongdoing, as she got previous permission from her “publicly funded” guardian to stay on the bus. The fact she acted quickly to mitigate the damages the bus driver and school district would be culpable for is really irrelevant in this case, but would get her acres in a job interview.
That said, I have just two questions:
How does she feel about going to College in Western New York?
And how many times did start your stories with, “When I was your age…”? Do you feel culpable? (okay, that was 3, but I just thought of that last one.)
I don’t know any more than what is printed in the news, but I think you’re also a hero in this story. Thanks for giving me hope that someday, somebody, somewhere, may yet make this planet right.
Tim
Personally I think what she did was truly a God-send because had she not gotten on the bus at all who knows what could have happened. More lives could have been injured, perhaps death could have taken its toll. My only other question is this, just how fast was that school bus going in order to throw the bus driver out of her seat? I know that isn’t the point here, but if anyone should be punished it should be the bus driver. Going on sharp turns at high speeds isn’t safe for anyone, especially buses.
This is for Tim and Cody K: Tim thank you for what you said. It actually made me cry. I’ll ask Amanda about the going to a college in Western New York. She’d have to take me too! LOL Who new a local story would escalate like this. In fact Amanda asked me if I thought she would get so much attention if she hadn’t gotten Saturday school. Pretty smart girl! I was hesitant about an article on her, but the head of the bus yard told me to go ahead. I think he regrets it now. He wasn’t very cordial yesterday when The Globe had a photographer out there taking pictures of her. Anyway thank you again. I appreciate the kind words. I’ve tried to raise all my kids to be honest and take responsiblity for their actions.
Cody, thank you for sticking up for Mr. Livermore!!! He IS an excellent principle and is well liked. Amanda agrees with you and that is why she isn’t upset over Saturday school. She knows she made a mistake staying on the bus.
Thank you both, Sally Correll
Okay, first of all to all of you who are saying the school has no legal position to take their decision– they do.
In the “Code of Conduct” for my public High School, there is the eery little line that dictates that the bus is also considered school property.
I can see where the school is coming from– they have the correct legal position to do it, and if they don’t take it, that could also be used against them. [What if she actually WAS hurt? A few days later she finds out that their was blood on steering wheel and she had an open wound in her hand?].
The outcome should re-justify the means. She should not be punished, I’m also going to send an email to this school to find what the hell they are doing. What they REALLY should do, is have her sign a waiver that she throws away all legal power to place any charges on the school for the events taking place on _datethatithappened_, and in turn she would be released from her sentence.
Gah, hit enter too quickly.
I just wanted to say– Amanda, that’s very good of you to continue taking the punishment. Very professional.
I personally try and act as professional as I can with everything I do, however I still would have requested expulsion. I can tell you’re a smart girl though, don’t do what I would.
You’re a hero in my eyes, I hope your day of detention involves a party, as it very well should.
The fact that she was able to stop that bus is awesome. She should get a lot of recognition for it.
However, she did ditch school. Once you’re on that bus, you are the school’s responsibility; you can’t just leave. It happened to work out in the favor of a lot of people, but that’s besides the point. Honestly, I wouldn’t be at all fussed if they decided not to punish her, but I don’t think it would be fair.
I’m glad she’s taking her punishment gracefully, and feel that doing so speaks very highly of her and her upbringing. I hope that she can get the detention out of the way and then go back to enjoying her new status as a hero.
SHE WAS NOT DITCHING she did not feel weel so she asked the bus driver to give her a ride to the bus yard then a ride home from there. If the bus driver would have said no she would have went to the nurce. If she were ditching she would not have been on the bus.
oops nurse
I am Amanda’s sister and i think what Amanda did was very nice.From what I heard I think it was mostly the bus drivers falt. I think Amanda does deserve Saturday school but it was some of her falt because she wasn’t supose to be on the bus…..
I posted few days ago but I have something else to add. I think that the bus driver should have some consequences to his actions. He/She (don’t know if they were male or female) is supposed to make sure that the everyone gets off the bus at the last stop (school). It is not his job to decide whether or not she goes to school. And the older student should not have made that decision either. If I put my child on the bus to school, that is where I expect them to go.
How about if we all send the poor girl a dollar or two?
That should then be put into a college fund and she can go to College, not only as a Real Hero, but for Free !
Can she set up a new Email address that we can send PayPal money to? Just a Buck a piece, what’dya say, everybody?
Hey Chuck, It’s grandma again. Nice idea but don’t see it happening. I will put my email address on here just to see. We don’t want to publish Amanda’s for obvious reasons. Also, thank you Saaje for what you wrote. Grandma loves you!!! Sally Correll kgjrbc@sbcglobal.net
Let me get this straight: Amanda goes on the bus. She gets sick. She informs her bus driver that she is sick. The bus driver (an adult in charge) must have agreed, or she never would have let Amanda stay on the bus. The bus driver “gets her foot stuck” in the brake, and somehow is thrown off the seat. How a competent, buckled-in adult can be thrown from her seat by a slow-moving car is beyond me. Amanda, while still sick, stops the bus. And she has to go to school on a weekend for “not following procedure”. Am I understanding this correctly? Are they really this stupid? Or just unable to admit they made a mistake?
#17 Steve Dean on 03.16.08 at 7:56 pm
I disagree - she knew the rules, she failed to follow the rules. This is just what the terrorist want! Do you people want Sadam Hussein to attach us again?
To Steve:
Excuse me? What rock have you been living under for the past few years? Sadam died. He’s dead. I won’t go into how it was bin Laden, not Sadam, who did 9/11, or how “terrorist” is supposed to be plural, but I sincerly wish to.
#50 Doug on 03.17.08 at 2:34 am
I agree with the school. If that girl had not followed proper procedure then she SHOULD be punished!
Who cares that she possibly saved lives? The fact is, she broke the rules. Deal with it you flunky!
Besides, she has now changed what was God’s plan for those children. To die a firey death on a school bus. So not only will she be punished by the school but now, she deserves to go to live with Satan.
To Doug:
So, according to you, by saving innocent children, keeping parents from feeling the pain of loss, acting with Christian compassion and love, she should be sent to Hell? Is that what you’re saying, Doug? Yeah, she broke the rules. That has absolutely nothing to do with the fact that she SAVED LIVES. Listen and repeat: Saved. Lives. Of Children. Of elementary-age children. That would be four-to-ten year olds, depending on the system. I don’t know about you, but I would rather save children from dying and go to Hell for it than live in Heaven knowing I could have saved them. At least I would always know that I had done one good thing in my life. That comment is seriously messed up, right there.
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